aznriptide859 Posted October 17, 2011 Report Share Posted October 17, 2011 How To: Mount an M4 Stock Adapter on an AK (MAG-K/Pignose Method) by aznriptide859 I will show you today how to mount an M4 buffer tube adapter the clean way - just like Costa/Haley does their MAG-K builds. It takes considerable more work and money to do it, but in the end the finish is MUCH better than other methods. Everyone knows that there are M4 stock adapters out there for the AK system already. The two most common methods are via the King Arms or G&P stock adapter, or the VLTOR stock adapter. Both adapters, although they work each have their cons. The G&P/KA method is a separate piece that attaches to the receiver, but is known to wobble after time (I had this problem with an earlier model). In this author's opinion the adapter juts out the back too far out, and although it gives two QD sling mount locations, it doesn't look very clean. The VLTOR method (CYMA, VFC, and LCT all make this) are either a receiver attachment or are integrated into the receiver itself. It is very solid, however the "wings" on top and the bottom don't allow for the stock to retract all the way. The adapter also allows for two QD sling mounts. Now most people should know me (and, it seems, a few others) have embarked on a MAG-K building spree, based on Chris Costa and Travis Haley's custom builds. Noveske on Arnie's has completed his MAG-K, while I am fixing some kinks in my MAG-KU. Both of us have been trying to find the best way to replicate the MAG-K's unique stock adapter. I am happy to say - I have found it. Below are the instructions on how to install/modify for it. First, you will need the following: -LCT AK Pistol Receiver (http://www.wgcshop.com/wgc2008/main/product_detail1.php?search_From=searchItem&item=LCT-PK-02&search=searchItem&rs=ak%20pistol&catid=&cat=) -ACE Pignose M4 Stock Adapter (http://store.carolinashooterssupply.com/servlet/-strse-170/ACE-CAR15-SAIGA-AK47/Detail) -Rotary Tool/Sander -Drill or Drill Press -Screws Now the receiver we're using is a bit pricey, but it is ALL steel - very good quality. LCT receivers all include side scope mounts stock - however I will be removing this (you may not choose to, up to you). The unique part of this receiver is the rear - unlike all other AK receivers, the rear plate is not slanted, and is one piece of flat sheet metal with a two-rivet sling mount. 1. We need to remove some rivets. The two on the rear (that hold the sling mount in) are mandatory - we will need the holes to mount the Pignose on. 2. This is optional, but you may also remove the three rivets that hold in the scope mount. The MAG-K does not have it, so I chose to remove it. Here is my poor-man's drill press that I was using - I later had to use a hand drill to remove the rear rivets. I started out with a 7/64-inch drill bit, then moved up until the tops of the rivets were removed/destroyed. Here's what the receiver looks like without the rivets. Link to post Share on other sites
aznriptide859 Posted October 17, 2011 Author Report Share Posted October 17, 2011 3. The Pignose has a small raised part that allows it to fit into Saiga receiver adapters (which, unfortunately won't fit AEG AK receivers). So, we need to remove it/sand it down. I simply used a sanding wheel on my Dremel. Here's the comparison of a modified Pignose with the stock Pignose. 4. After this, it's easy - screw on the adapter to the receiver! You can see here the holes line up...provided you slant the adapter. You have two options: --I. Slant the adapter to immediately mount the adapter to the receiver (as seen in consequent pictures as I was lazy). However remember if you're routing the wires through the stock, you'll need to drill yourself new holes. Note the buffer tube setting screw will also be slanted in this case. --II. Redrill holes in the adapter to make sure it is "right side up". This involves a bit more work, but looks nicer/more even in the end. I will be doing this in the future, however for the purpose of this how-to I used method I. Here's what it looks like mounted - clean isn't it? A comparison to my old stock adapter method on my MAG-KU - it is a LOT more solid (my old adapter was held on by one screw and some JBWeld, which I didn't trust one bit). I can also retract my stock in further. Stock/buffer tube attached: And done! You also have the option of drilling and tapping your own sling stud (which I will do later) - stay tuned for a further instructional! That's it - pretty easy if you know what you're doing. The cost is a bit pricey (about $100+ for the entire setup), but it looks cleaner, is shorter and sturdier than other M4 adapter methods, and overall, gets you closer to that accurate interpretation of the MAG-K. Thanks for reading! Comments/suggestions are welcome. Link to post Share on other sites
bankz5152 Posted October 18, 2011 Report Share Posted October 18, 2011 Wow. I personally hate AKs but that actually makes me want to buy one and do this mod! Very well done, very clean and very simple. Im sure the $100 price tag is worth it to some people! Link to post Share on other sites
uscmCorps Posted October 18, 2011 Report Share Posted October 18, 2011 Great tutorial. Nicely done. If I did it, I'd probably run wires into the stock like you suggested and use buffer tube lipos like on all my ARs to keep the battery setups the same. This looks like a solid fix. Link to post Share on other sites
DesertFoxRomel Posted October 18, 2011 Report Share Posted October 18, 2011 Not my cup of tea, but outstanding write up, OP. Makes me want to hit up the hardware store and do some modding. Link to post Share on other sites
aznriptide859 Posted October 18, 2011 Author Report Share Posted October 18, 2011 Thanks for the kind words - it took days of planning (both me and Noveske) and I finally got one of them to work - very satisfying haha. Got some more work done today, drilled two new hole to accommodate the adapter right side up. Now the set grub screw is on the bottom. Yay! On the road to rebuild (this LCT receiver is a godsend...SO much better than my old Dboys one). Link to post Share on other sites
uscmCorps Posted October 18, 2011 Report Share Posted October 18, 2011 So will you use RS buffer tubes on this project or can you use AEG lipo ready buffer tubes? If the threading is correct on the AEG buffer tube, that'll be handy in that it's already opened up in the rear. That said, it may be more beneficial to get a RS buffer tube bore open the end cap and insert lipos from there. The limitation of the AEG buffer is that it's overall shorter as it has less length at the threaded end as it doesn't screw into the receiver via those threads and has therefore been cut short by design ... which in turn means your collapsible length has been reduced too. The RS buffer tube, while kind of a pain to bore out the solid end cap (I had to do that for my ARES SR-25 EMC) will give you the correct length buffer tube, and a whole lot more internal space (mostly in terms of length) over the AEG version. Curious what you decided to do. Link to post Share on other sites
aznriptide859 Posted October 19, 2011 Author Report Share Posted October 19, 2011 As of now I've been using GBBR buffer tubes. The one I have on there right now is a 5KU one, which is to my knowledge the only GBBR buffer tube that has a screwable cap on the back, making lipo replacement ridiculously easy (I have one on my recce rifle). I've never tried AEG ones, and I don't think I ever will. I really want to use a RS buffer...but boring out the entire back is a lot of work, not to mention where on earth I'd find a drill bit large enough to do that lol. How did you do it for your ARES build? Link to post Share on other sites
uscmCorps Posted October 19, 2011 Report Share Posted October 19, 2011 It was an epic pain in the butt. I started out with small brill bits and incrementally increased the bit diameter till I got to 1/2" bits. Then I used my dremel with a grinding or coarse grain sanding drum. Once I removed all the material I sanded the edges. It was a slow and tedious workflow. I was not aware of the 5KU one. Probably would have gone with that had I known the RS buffer tube would be as much work as it was. Though made from aluminum, the grade of aluminum is pretty durable and material thickness is ... well very thick. So it took some time. So long as you like the feel and finish of the 5KU one, I'd stick with that. Got a link for it? Also, regarding the small raised strip on the ACE Pignose M4 Stock Adapter that you sanded off, did you consider cut a respective hole in the rear of the receiver to interface with it, or did you worry that it may weaken the rear receiver too much to do that and/or be too much trouble to do? Link to post Share on other sites
aznriptide859 Posted October 19, 2011 Author Report Share Posted October 19, 2011 The rear plate on the LCT receiver is too thin to accommodate for it; had I chose to fit the indent I would've drilled an oval shaped hole in the plate to fit the pignose without modification. The PIgnose is supposed to fit this adapter for Saigas initially (there's an indent in that that accommodates for the Pignose): http://store.carolinashooterssupply.com/servlet/-strse-372/Saiga-AK47-Internal-Stock/Detail The finish of the 5KU is ok, so far using my Magpul MOE stock the upper finish/paint has started to wear off (though most of the time you don't see it anyways). The only place I know that offers it is eHobby - I haven't taken the time to search for it on other sites. The rear cap is removable via a 2.5mm allen wrench, which is extremely handy - it's hollow enough inside to allow for G&P buffer tube lipos easily. http://shop.ehobbyasia.com/5ku-wa-6-position-stock-pipe-for-wa-m4-series.html Oh heck it's in stock, time to order some more LOL. Link to post Share on other sites
Bersy Posted October 19, 2011 Report Share Posted October 19, 2011 Great how to guide! i really want one of thoses pignose adaptors.. if anyone doesnt mind buying and posting one to the UK let me know please as i must have one!! Link to post Share on other sites
uscmCorps Posted October 19, 2011 Report Share Posted October 19, 2011 Yeah, I would definitely get that 5KU one and not bother with the RS buffer. And if you end up running wires into the buffer and you're using a stock with a covered back plate (like a CTR or MOE stock), I would just leave the buffer tube open without the cap screwed in for quick swap-ability of the battery. Link to post Share on other sites
Horsem4n Posted October 19, 2011 Report Share Posted October 19, 2011 awesome guide, really appretiate this. one thing though, how are you going to go about covering up the holes left from removing the rivots of the scope mount? Link to post Share on other sites
aznriptide859 Posted October 19, 2011 Author Report Share Posted October 19, 2011 Just using JBWeld. Link to post Share on other sites
uscmCorps Posted October 19, 2011 Report Share Posted October 19, 2011 How are you going to refinish the side of the receiver to match the rest. This is frequently the part that frustrates me in a project. I remove a part thinking the finish underneath will look the same ... and that is not the case. DOH! Also, on the ACE Pignose M4 Stock Adapter, is the function of the bottom set screw / grub screw to keep the buffer tube indexed correctly and inline with the rest of the gun? If so, then it sounds like drilling new holes to mount the adapter to the receiver and get that grub screw in the right place was well worth it. Link to post Share on other sites
aznriptide859 Posted October 19, 2011 Author Report Share Posted October 19, 2011 The receiver will be painted using Alumahyde, so that I don't have to worry about lol. I will lightly sand the area to get rid of the rust. And yes, the set screw on the Pignose keeps the buffer tube in place/from rotating. Link to post Share on other sites
uscmCorps Posted October 19, 2011 Report Share Posted October 19, 2011 Are you going to use Alumahyde II? My only issue with Alumhyde II (not sure if this applies to regular Alumhyde) is that it gives you a reasonably strong finish, but there's definitely a texture to the finish. I prefer a perfectly smooth finish myself. I don't know if there is anyway to get around that. Cerakote is another option and there are plenty of companies that do it as a service. On the other hand, if you're not trying to restore the receiver to the original blued finish, and just plan on painting it Magpul FDE, a few coats of Coyote Alumhyde II should be fine. Link to post Share on other sites
aznriptide859 Posted October 19, 2011 Author Report Share Posted October 19, 2011 Hmm I always get a nice smooth finish all the time, albeit it is a bit shiny not flat. I heat cure all my applications, not sure if that makes a difference. Link to post Share on other sites
Collat3ral Posted October 20, 2011 Report Share Posted October 20, 2011 I don't want to steal the thread, but here is how I mounted a m4 stock on a AK. I had a JG beta and luckily for me, it had the straight back end (not slanted). I removed the stock mounts, and grounded the tabs on the body. So I had a flat surface with a hole in the middle. Then I got a piece of 5mm ALU, grind it to size, that it can fit inside of the body and doesn't interfere with the GB. Drill a hole in the ALU and cut a M5 thread. Put the ALU inside of the body, position the stock tube and tighten. The metal on metal friction holds the tube firmly in place. I can't rotate it, when it's tightened. I also added a M5 nut on the end of the screw for better strength. Real pics will follow when I get home from work. Total cost: 0€ Link to post Share on other sites
aznriptide859 Posted October 20, 2011 Author Report Share Posted October 20, 2011 Nicely done - I'm assuming you used an AEG buffer tube? Link to post Share on other sites
adadqgg Posted October 20, 2011 Report Share Posted October 20, 2011 The receiver will be painted using Alumahyde, so that I don't have to worry about lol. I will lightly sand the area to get rid of the rust. And yes, the set screw on the Pignose keeps the buffer tube in place/from rotating. Why not go all the way and blue the receiver? I want to say "No innocent AK receiver was harmed in the making of this project"...but obviously that is not true. XD Link to post Share on other sites
RacingManiac Posted October 20, 2011 Report Share Posted October 20, 2011 Gotta keep this thread in mind when I get into GBB AKs... Link to post Share on other sites
DFM56 Posted October 20, 2011 Report Share Posted October 20, 2011 Maniac, you can probably get away with an internal block in that case depending on how the stocks and pistol grips attach on the GBBR. Why not go all the way and blue the receiver? I want to say "No innocent AK receiver was harmed in the making of this project"...but obviously that is not true. XD It's usually pretty hard to blue things FDE. Link to post Share on other sites
Collat3ral Posted October 21, 2011 Report Share Posted October 21, 2011 Pics as promised: I know about the positive wire, I will move it And I used a AEG buffer tube. Link to post Share on other sites
uscmCorps Posted October 21, 2011 Report Share Posted October 21, 2011 How do you keep the buffer tube from rotating? Link to post Share on other sites
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