WE Gas Blow Back M4A1 Carbine

[inque]

Do you guys know of any quick way of lowering the FPS of the gun?

 

As of the moment the Steel Nozzle Assembly Kit - A from airsoft buddy (300fps version) is out of stock and looks like it will be for quite awhile.

 

Any temporary solutions until I the nozzle goes back in stock? Planning to get it down to 400fps if possible, or anything below 450, I will be a happy camper

[Carsten]

I used a small piece of plastic which I put behind #42 to push it forward.. its working well so far..

 

[WETTI]

I think you're missing the point vicious. The fact that they could explode when exposed to sunlight on a hot summer day as opposed to aerosol cans and propane tanks calls for a trip to the drawing board. Furthurmore, I remain doubtful on the "escape channels" as claimed by WETTI.

 

It is silly for you to suggest that we as customers pay the manufacturer for the magazines and then conduct a destructive test on behalf of them. I wouldn't mind spending time if it was a non-destructive test, or the manufacturer provides me the magazines for the test if they are confident on the safety of their magazines. The latter would might as well be done by the manufacturer themselves.

 

You're right in deciding to say the last thing on mag temp, as I think there might not be more educated discussion coming from you.

 

Pls kindly do a bit more research before making any baseless "I remain doubtful" assumption of what I've stated. Do you think I'm so stupid as to making a false claim on a world renown forum? Have you completely disassemble one of our mags, or do you even own one?

 

The escape channel is located on the top of the mag. I cannot show you an illustrated pic of it yet because I'm currently at the U.S. Army Rangers' 5th RTB conducting an official demo of our platform. It is with pleasure that I should share with all of you that official funding aprroval had been secured at Fort Benning for purchasing our AWSS CO2 M4 platform as a simulation training tool for the U.S. Army.

 

Once again I want to clarify about our regular gas mags: Even though we do not believe that our mag has any design falults, but once we've received news that some mags had exploded during use (first incident several months ago), we've immediately started an in-depth examination/investigation of the design & construction of our mag. We've found no evidence whatsoever that would contribute to our mags to explode under normal use circumstances. But yet we've strengthened our mag's structure even more to account for user negligence.

 

Again, pls kindly DO NOT make baseless assumptions or accusations that WE, as a maunfacturer, did not address the issue. Me not saying anything here does not contribute the lack-of-action on our part. I'm only here as much as my schedule allows, and more often than not, I can barely keep up with this wonderful thread. My most sincere thanks to all of you who's had contributed & made positive criticism of our platform, but I could care less about those who's made baseless, vicious attacks of our products.

 

That is all I have to say.

 

WETTI

 

O...btw...no law suit would stick since our mags are not shipped filled with gas. The type of gas used by the end user is a rather subjective matter, not to mention user negligence in regard to storage. We're already stated that our mags should only use Green Gas or below, and the mags should not be exposed to DIRECT sunlight for an extended period of time. Furthermore, our mags should NEVER be stored with a full or even half charge of gas; they should be stored empty or with a just a 'puff' of gas to keep the seals tight & lubricated.

[newcomer]

That's good news. When can we expect to get our hands on the new strengthened propane mags?

 

Edit: Erm I did state that it is possible that the escape channels or pressure relieve device is/are not working as intended. Also, can you kindly elaborate on the intended function of the escape channel? I think the term is ambigous because it could also mean an escape channel for over flowing propane should the mag gets filled more than full? I'm sorry if my tone came off as vicious. Clearly wasn't my intention.

Edited May 29, 2009 by newcomer

[rottenotto]

WETTI

 

O...btw...no law suit would stick since our mags are not shipped filled with gas. The type of gas used by the end user is a rather subjective matter, not to mention user negligence in regard to storage. We're already stated that our mags should only use Green Gas or below, and the mags should not be exposed to DIRECT sunlight for an extended period of time. Furthermore, our mags should NEVER be stored with a full or even half charge of gas; they should be stored empty or with a just a 'puff' of gas to keep the seals tight & lubricated.

 

 

That might be true, but a if a few more explode - and God forbid - one person is hurt, that will be the end of these guns (end of WE) in the states. Your product will be all over the news stateside and banned immediately.

 

One DROZD CO2 bb gun made the news and they were banned on eBay the next day. Then the feds made it REAL hard on Bakail - temporarily stopping importation completely. (and those werent "exploding")

 

All the distribution deals (evike etc) you have worked so hard to create will be gone in a second.

 

The liberals in the USA have a "hard on" for guns - toy guns, real guns, makes no difference. They want to stamp them ALL out. Just give them a reason to crusade againt you. Draw attention to yourself and I guarantee it will happen.

 

 

 

[redline]

Pls kindly do a bit more research before making any baseless "I remain doubtful" assumption of what I've stated. Do you think I'm so stupid as to making a false claim on a world renown forum? Have you completely disassemble one of our mags, or do you even own one?

 

The escape channel is located on the top of the mag. I cannot show you an illustrated pic of it yet because I'm currently at the U.S. Army Rangers' 5th RTB conducting an official demo of our platform. It is with pleasure that I should share with all of you that official funding aprroval had been secured at Fort Benning for purchasing our AWSS CO2 M4 platform as a simulation training tool for the U.S. Army.

 

Once again I want to clarify about our regular gas mags: Even though we do not believe that our mag has any design falults, but once we've received news that some mags had exploded during use (first incident several months ago), we've immediately started an in-depth examination/investigation of the design & construction of our mag. We've found no evidence whatsoever that would contribute to our mags to explode under normal use circumstances. But yet we've strengthened our mag's structure even more to account for user negligence.

 

Again, pls kindly DO NOT make baseless assumptions or accusations that WE, as a maunfacturer, did not address the issue. Me not saying anything here does not contribute the lack-of-action on our part. I'm only here as much as my schedule allows, and more often than not, I can barely keep up with this wonderful thread. My most sincere thanks to all of you who's had contributed & made positive criticism of our platform, but I could care less about those who's made baseless, vicious attacks of our products.

 

That is all I have to say.

 

WETTI

 

O...btw...no law suit would stick since our mags are not shipped filled with gas. The type of gas used by the end user is a rather subjective matter, not to mention user negligence in regard to storage. We're already stated that our mags should only use Green Gas or below, and the mags should not be exposed to DIRECT sunlight for an extended period of time. Furthermore, our mags should NEVER be stored with a full or even half charge of gas; they should be stored empty or with a just a 'puff' of gas to keep the seals tight & lubricated.

 

WETTI, I probably missed it, but were these instructions found anywhere in the manual...or perhaps even on the box the magazines came in? I'm afraid a person that doesn't frequent airsoft forums might not know.

 

[redline]

A magazine of a different design and manufacturer hardly constitutes as control. Control should be a WE magazine under the shade exposed only to ambient temperature.

 

I'll also put into the mix that WE mags CAN actually be overfilled. Open up any Japanese gbb magazine and you'd find the fill valve to have some kind of tubular extension of sorts (roughly to half the length of the reservoir). This limits the amount of liquid pumped into the mag thereby limiting the possibility of it being over filled and reach destructive pressures. This tube is absent on the WE mag so as long as you jam that can of gas in the mag, its going to pump in fuel until its full to the brim. I believe installing this simple device should work in keeping mags from blowing up because other than exploding from excessive heat, all cases are similar in that they were just previously filled and possibly overfilled.

 

That's good to know.

[redline]

Forgot to add...if escape channels are present in the design, why aren't they working? Isn't the purpose of escape channels prevention of exploding mags? Someone enlighten me.....

 

*edit* Oops. Newcomer asked the same thing.

Edited May 29, 2009 by redline

[Marky [UE]]

@WETTI

 

Thanks for taking the time to post during what must be a very busy period for you.

 

The escape channel is located on the top of the mag. I cannot show you an illustrated pic of it yet

 

That might explain the slight bleed I get at the moment, I do however get a bleed from the top and bottom of the spine. I could also be filling the mags too full but to be honest I'm not sure how to measure this. It would be really helpful to understand exactly what should and shouldn't be expected of the WE M4 gas mag and the illustrated pic would be a useful start.

 

It is with pleasure that I should share with all of you that official funding aprroval had been secured at Fort Benning for purchasing our AWSS CO2 M4 platform as a simulation training tool for the U.S. Army.

 

Glad everything is going well, I am looking forward to further feedback! More importantly I am looking forward to testing CO2 myself

 

Once again I want to clarify about our regular gas mags: Even though we do not believe that our mag has any design falults, but once we've received news that some mags had exploded during use (first incident several months ago), we've immediately started an in-depth examination/investigation of the design & construction of our mag. We've found no evidence whatsoever that would contribute to our mags to explode under normal use circumstances. But yet we've strengthened our mag's structure even more to account for user negligence.

 

Obviously as a community we aren't aware of the total number of magazines shipped or the actual failure rates or types of failure. It also appears that the magazines have no manufacturing tag so it would be difficult to know if for example they all came from the same batch. Some people have made huge assumptions as to the cause of the known incidents and this can and has led to heated and unconstructive debates and baseless comments.

 

It's only my opinion but I believe the community just want to be confident in the mags and if this means you have to substantiate your internal testing by providing detailed explanations then that may be a small price to pay in the long term.

 

My own confidence has been influenced by experience with the two magazines I have, and then rightly or wrongly by the few incidents described on various forums. The metal used has in my case proven to be very brittle, although it has not exploded. I for one would prefer the magazines to substantially exceed any intentional or unintentional user negligence I or the environment might throw at them. If this would cause a price increase due to the use of higher spec components then I wouldn't have a problem.

 

Having said all that this issue/discussion is not a major concern for me yet, I have nothing but smiles when I use my WE M4. I would appreciate some additional and official reassurance/guidance though.

 

Thanks again for all your community input, sorry for the long but hopefully constructive post.

Edited May 29, 2009 by Marky [UE]

[ViciousV10s]

It is with pleasure that I should share with all of you that official funding aprroval had been secured at Fort Benning for purchasing our AWSS CO2 M4 platform as a simulation training tool for the U.S. Army.

 

 

Congrats! That is awesome news!

 

 

[bbstriker]

The only and last thing I want to say about the claimed temps of the mags is that the people don't actually KNOW what temperature the MAG was at when it exploded. Just because it was in an environment where the ambient temp was "40C" you have no way of knowing the actual temp the MAG reached sitting in direct sunlight.

 

So who wants to go take one of those IR temp gauges, put their mag in the sunlight, and wait for it to explode so we know what the real point of failure is?

Of course you can know the temp of metal exposed to sunlight. Metal will absorb heat and radiate heat. It will at some temp reach equilibrium - i.e. radiate as much as it receives- a stable temp no matter how long its exposed to the sun. I'm not going find all the equations but the general rule of thumb for metal is approximately between 15 to 20 C above ambient temp in direct sunlight.

 

My mag exploded with an ambient temp of 20C so t was probably around 35C but possibly an absolute worst case max of 40C.

 

Anyway I'm sure eventually the quality of the mags will improve and become more consistent. I used my WE today with 26C ambient temp and it was pretty awsome!

[WETTI]

May29/2009 - Full squad of U.S. Army Rangers at the 5th Rangers Training Battalion at Camp Frank D. Merrill, Dahlonega, Georgia, USA

 

 

Same squad of Rangers coming to attention

 

[KWP]

May29/2009 - Full squad of U.S. Army Rangers at the 5th Rangers Training Battalion at Camp Frank D. Merrill, Dahlonega, Georgia, USA

 

http://f.imagehost.org/0128/P1000418a.jpg

 

Same squad of Rangers coming to attention

 

http://f.imagehost.org/0255/P1000496a.jpg

Will you equip the entire U.S. Armed Forces with your WE toy guns or will it just fill a tiny niche amongst the AEGs, Paintball markers, RAMs, RAPs, MILES and Simmunition system they already have for training?

Edited May 30, 2009 by KWP

[freq88]

I think it's very unfair and totally baseless to call any and all "exploding" mags user negligence. As for a lawsuit not holding don't count your breath. If a lady can sue McDonald's for serving hot coffee that she accidently spilled and burnt herself and win. Then any incident involving any of your products can and will result in the same ruling. Especially, since it's mainly exported as a "toy".

[AustinWolv]

And which M249s are they using there?

[Andrew March]

Anyone know a real steel magpul stockist in the UK

[chris u'5]

Anyone know a real steel magpul stockist in the UK

You'll find them at John Bull and Firesupport for starters.

[Andrew March]

Sorry Chris I must be going mad, John Bull brings up a military clothing company but Magpul aren't listed as a manufacturer on their site and firesupport only sell the airsoft MIAD grips.

 

Anyone else have any ideas?

[chris u'5]

Yup you are going mad.

 

http://www.fire-support.co.uk/store/comers...?idProduct=2026

 

http://www.fire-support.co.uk/store/comers...?idProduct=2188

 

http://www.fire-support.co.uk/store/comers...?idProduct=2027

 

http://www.johnbullclothing.com/products.asp?ID=2644

 

Do you want some more links?

 

http://www.uktactical.com/cgi-bin/sh000005...ehtml%23a64#a64

 

http://www.tactical-kit.co.uk/magpul-556-205-p.asp

 

http://www.army-surplus.co.uk/militarygear...uct/magpul.html

 

[LordElpus]

Of course you can know the temp of metal exposed to sunlight. Metal will absorb heat and radiate heat. It will at some temp reach equilibrium - i.e. radiate as much as it receives- a stable temp no matter how long its exposed to the sun. I'm not going find all the equations but the general rule of thumb for metal is approximately between 15 to 20 C above ambient temp in direct sunlight.

 

My mag exploded with an ambient temp of 20C so t was probably around 35C but possibly an absolute worst case max of 40C.

 

Anyway I'm sure eventually the quality of the mags will improve and become more consistent. I used my WE today with 26C ambient temp and it was pretty awsome!

 

Wasn't it also on a sofa? How effectively would your black mag radiate heat whilst it is sat in direct sunlight thru a glass window whilst sat on insulating material? The heat would bleed off into the sofa until the foam gets to the same temp as the mag. at that point the mag will continue to heat up.

[bbstriker]

Wasn't it also on a sofa? How effectively would your black mag radiate heat whilst it is sat in direct sunlight thru a glass window whilst sat on insulating material? The heat would bleed off into the sofa until the foam gets to the same temp as the mag. at that point the mag will continue to heat up.

Possibly but the mag would still reach a point where it would stop heating up and reach a stable temp- again usually at around or between +15C and 20C. The sofa material is not a great conductor of heat so all the remaining exposed surface area of the mag would be radiating excess heat. I don't tink the sofa made much difference- a little for sure but I don't think that significant.

 

[Autotechnica]

Anyone know where I can get a reinforced mil-spec charging handle? Horizon Tactical seems to be offline now and they aren't taking anymore orders past the month of May. Honestly screw ASB, so any other suggestions for North America? Anyone get anything from TS-One? I had good communications with them for 2 weeks straight then they seemed to have fallen off the face of the earth.

 

My WE reinforced charging handle just broke in 2.

 

thanks,

 

Bryan

Edited May 30, 2009 by Autotechnica

[ViciousV10s]

Anyone know where I can get a reinforced mil-spec charging handle? Horizon Tactical seems to be offline now and they aren't taking anymore orders past the month of May. Honestly screw ASB, so any other suggestions for North America? Anyone get anything from TS-One? I had good communications with them for 2 weeks straight then they seemed to have fallen off the face of the earth.

 

My WE reinforced charging handle just broke in 2.

 

thanks,

 

Bryan

 

Not Milspec but CNC AL.

 

http://www.ipscgm.com/index.php?main_page=...roducts_id=1496

 

I ordered one but haven't received any shipping notification from them yet...and it's been a few days Im starting to wonder about their service.

 

THese are also the same PRI handles seen on Redwolf for the WA/PTW systems...so they might just be the same...can anyone clarify?

 

The Magpul PTS grip I bought from Redwolf that said it also fit the WE needed modification for the selector spring hole in the grip. Wondering just how man of the external parts for WE/WA are actually compatible.

 

New pic of my WE with a little Magpul.com ad on it, WE + Magpul = FTW!

 

Edited May 30, 2009 by ViciousV10s

[L4byr1nth]

Hey guys.

 

Really thinking about getting one of these, but has anyone tried the M16A3 variant?

 

I haven't seen one at my site - are they even in the UK yet?

 

Are there any differences from the M4 to the M16, in terms of the mechanism?

 

Sorry if there's already a thread on it - I couldn't find it!

 

Also, any reviews?

 

Cheers!

 

Ben.

[Marky [UE]]

Yup you are going mad.

 

http://www.fire-support.co.uk/store/comers...?idProduct=2026

 

http://www.fire-support.co.uk/store/comers...?idProduct=2188

 

http://www.fire-support.co.uk/store/comers...?idProduct=2027

 

http://www.johnbullclothing.com/products.asp?ID=2644

 

Do you want some more links?

 

http://www.uktactical.com/cgi-bin/sh000005...ehtml%23a64#a64

 

http://www.tactical-kit.co.uk/magpul-556-205-p.asp

 

http://www.army-surplus.co.uk/militarygear...uct/magpul.html

 

You might have been a bit too literal in your interpretation on this Chris, I think he was referring to the full real steel range of components i.e. the MOE hand guards, grips, stocks etc.

 

There are very few UK suppliers with stock of the RS items due to US export restrictions and current worldwide stock. You can get the RS MIAD from the Southern Gun Company (I can dig a link out later if you need it). CTR stocks are hard to come by as are the hand guards. The best alternative is for a good friend to send you a present from the US.

 

I have the RS MOE hand guard (had to make some minor mods due to movement, I can explain if required) and RS MIAD (perfect fit using the WE bolt) fitted to mine. The RS Aluminium Trigger Guard doesn't fit, needs some pretty major modification and is sat in a drawer. RS Magpul MBUS is on its way to me now.

Edited May 30, 2009 by Marky [UE]