FarEast Posted November 9, 2007 Report Share Posted November 9, 2007 As many of you are aware I posted some information a while back on the ICS L85A2 that was scheduled to be released this autumn. The response to that post was that many of the members here were not happy with certain aspects of the prototype. Having worked with ICS on some of the issues and also the ICS R&D team having an active involvement with the members of Arnie's Airsoft forums ICS was more than happy to make those changes and improve on the design based on your observations. So here it is the Arnie's improved ICS L85A2, please post comments and suggestions remember though, they plan to have this out just before Christams!: Link to post Share on other sites
FarEast Posted November 9, 2007 Author Report Share Posted November 9, 2007 Link to post Share on other sites
crablegs Posted November 9, 2007 Report Share Posted November 9, 2007 Sweet, any specs or features? Link to post Share on other sites
The Crunchy Bunny Posted November 10, 2007 Report Share Posted November 10, 2007 Dang, that looks pretty nice. I'd like to see some pics of the internals if you got em. Link to post Share on other sites
Gigueand Posted November 10, 2007 Report Share Posted November 10, 2007 I'm quite happy that they actually listened to the input of the community. If all airsoft manufacturers worked this way we'd see a lot better product for our hard earned dollars (err, euro, pound, etc). Link to post Share on other sites
lmission Posted November 10, 2007 Report Share Posted November 10, 2007 very nice pics. i am a big time ICS supporter and i own and maintain one gun in each of their series (MP5, M4, AK). i am excited that they are doing something like this for the British weapon. there are a lot of people interested in this gun and will buy it knowing that it is ICS quality. so now, my comments and questions: here is a Wiki link to the picture of the real thing (look at this and compare it with the pictures posted here): http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/comm..._rifle_1996.jpg 1.) why is the bolt lever different than the real thing. G&G and Army both have copies that are accurate to the real deal. why does ICS have a different bolt handle? it is dumb. 2.) i assume that the battery will be in the front grip. what is the largest battery that can fit in here? 3.) ARMY and G&G have a two piece gearbox. ICS M4 series has a two piece gearbox and is what i enjoy about both guns. will this have a 2 piece gearbox? 4.) what size is the gearbox and will you use a 19 teeth piston (like ARMY and G&G) or standard 16 teeth. fyi, i own an Army R85 and have made the G&G downgrade and this works better -- it supports an M120 spring and cycling on a 9.6V battery works better. 5.) does the bolt blowback? i enjoy this feature and hope that they do let this blowback. 6.) ArmyR85 has a spring release located inside the magazine well. ICS M4 uses the forward assist button to release the spring. I enjoy them both. will ICS have a spring release for this one. 7.) will the rail system/handle system accept a STAR SUSAT scope. Army R85 rail system accepts non STAR SUSAT scope and this bugs people looking for authenticity. i realize that configuring the rail for the STAR limits options. so, does ICS have a plan to make their own SUSAT with standard rail size or provide a kit that improves the design so that you can fit SUSAT/non-SUSAT scopes. 8.) will the gearbox be able to handle Li-Po like the new KWA M4A1? Li-po is the new NiMh and more people will use this for the longer play time. 9.) the magazine well will accept standard M16 mags? 10.) access to internals on ARMY R85/G&G is easy == one pin to remove and slides right out. ICS L85 is same? 11.) metal hop-up (please???) 12.) make a matching SA-80 sling to go with this. they are difficult to find in America. thanks! Link to post Share on other sites
Pinkfloyd Posted November 10, 2007 Report Share Posted November 10, 2007 It's still just an SA80. I have a VERY low opinion of all SA80 based guns, just because of the original design being so bad... Link to post Share on other sites
RSM Posted November 10, 2007 Report Share Posted November 10, 2007 Something still seems off with the hold open catch and fire selector, other than that though I like the look so far, although I wouldn't mind a reassurance from ICS that different foregrips can be put on the gun. I much prefer the old style of hand guard but thats a personal preferance. lmission: The bolt lever is different as this AEG repliates the A2 variant of the L85, the one you are looking at is the older A1, ICS have previously stated the largest battery is an 8.4 1800mah nicad I _think_, in reality this means up to an 8.4 4200mah battery as no one uses nicad anymore (generally). I can't answer anything else up to the lipo question, any gearbox can take lipol as long as you are careful, a member on here runs his CA36s on 11.1v lipols and I don't think CA mentioned anything about lipols back then. Standard M16 mags are a no brainer yes, internals access could very well be similar to other L85s out there but we'll have to wait and see, ICS have already shown us a metal (And quite beefy) looking hop unit. By the time I finish a gun project I've got going, fix my L96 and get some other things sorted I'll try and catch the second gen of these for sure. EDIT: Pinkfloyd The original, original design for the L85 (And I don't mean the EM-2) would have been way ahead of its time, unforetunately due to the fact that all weapons are made by the lowest bidder, especially in the UK, the L85 became rather pants until some germans fixed it, if I remember correctly in some trials the A2 beat the M16 for both reliability and accuracy, so what if its a bit heavy for a modern assault rifle, the only people I've seen who can't handle the thing are 5 foot odd cadets ANYWAY Link to post Share on other sites
Stealthbomber Posted November 10, 2007 Report Share Posted November 10, 2007 Now all ICS need to do is invent a time-machine, travel back to 2004, and release it when people were still gagging for a gun better than the one made by Academy. Link to post Share on other sites
Revenge Seeker Posted November 10, 2007 Report Share Posted November 10, 2007 Wow... this forum contributes to the designing of AEGs from big name companies like ICS? That is amazing! In respect to the real steel images of the L85a2, there are quite a few differences but those differences, in my opinion, make it a ton more nicer than the real thing. Link to post Share on other sites
lmission Posted November 10, 2007 Report Share Posted November 10, 2007 Something still seems off with the hold open catch and fire selector, other than that though I like the look so far, although I wouldn't mind a reassurance from ICS that different foregrips can be put on the gun. I much prefer the old style of hand guard but thats a personal preferance. lmission: The bolt lever is different as this AEG repliates the A2 variant of the L85, the one you are looking at is the older A1, ICS have previously stated the largest battery is an 8.4 1800mah nicad I _think_, in reality this means up to an 8.4 4200mah battery as no one uses nicad anymore (generally). I can't answer anything else up to the lipo question, any gearbox can take lipol as long as you are careful, a member on here runs his CA36s on 11.1v lipols and I don't think CA mentioned anything about lipols back then. Standard M16 mags are a no brainer yes, internals access could very well be similar to other L85s out there but we'll have to wait and see, ICS have already shown us a metal (And quite beefy) looking hop unit. By the time I finish a gun project I've got going, fix my L96 and get some other things sorted I'll try and catch the second gen of these for sure. cheers mate for the added insight. one last question...so the pictures are what will be sent by Xmas or will they look at this forum to try add the features we all want (I want...)? frankly, m8, unless i see pix of the internals, i'm simply not impressed. moreoever, i saw the first pictures of the ICS prototype in the spring and they were ######s -- the foregrip was wide and weird and just dumb. i really like ICS and will continue to support them but i am reserving my joy for this gun until i see more. btw, i just want to add ARMY R85 is a good gun but be forewarned, the internals are ######, QC is non-existent....however for the intrepid gun hobbyists like me, i saw it as a personal challenge to make the gun work the way i want and i'm on schedule to get this. BUT...if this ICS turns out to be a good gun, well...off the R85 goes to the highest bidder. Link to post Share on other sites
snorkelman Posted November 10, 2007 Report Share Posted November 10, 2007 well I'm impressed by their willingness to stick at it but just have overwhelming feeling its too late to market (not neccessarily too little too late but too late all the same) I do wonder wether they'd have been better canceling this once it started to get bogged down in favour of getting ahead of the competition on another gun rather than playing catch up on this one. anyways far as external shape goes it looks OK not sure of the finish (Im guessing its just the photos that are giving it that kinda grey look) and not sure of that handguard ie way the front piece clips on to rest of the handguard and possibly the depth/shape of the vents (though again vents could just be the angles of the photos) Link to post Share on other sites
AustinWolv Posted November 10, 2007 Report Share Posted November 10, 2007 I obviously can't talk for the US, but a number of players I know aren't overly thrilled with the STAR, G&G, and Army versions out there, so the ICS might pique their interest. Link to post Share on other sites
ChasKi Posted November 10, 2007 Report Share Posted November 10, 2007 I have the Army one, if I was serious about an L85 (i.e. not buying a clone gun) i'd definately consider the ICS. I wasn't too keen on the charging handle either though. A1 or A2, i'd rip it off and replace the thing with an A1 anyways. Blow back would bea big thing for me, never thought it would be, however, the Army R85 is alot of fun with the blowback and I really enjoy it. I think the selling point of the ICS will be in the gearbox. If it's standard 16 tooth piston, it should attract alot of buyer who do not want to bother with the 19 tooth piston & it's issues. Link to post Share on other sites
amateurstuntman Posted November 10, 2007 Report Share Posted November 10, 2007 Looks good but the bolt holding open device in the picture is on upside-down. Probably just an assembly error but it really doesn't need to go out to the shops that way. A few tiny cosmetic quibbles aside it is really nice. Problem is since it isn't showcasing a two part gearbox and realistic field strip it probably doesn't have it. Nice though. Link to post Share on other sites
Bizurkur Posted November 10, 2007 Report Share Posted November 10, 2007 Needs more AG36. then, and only then, will that be an attractive weapon. Link to post Share on other sites
sniper_boi Posted November 10, 2007 Report Share Posted November 10, 2007 Im jus hoping that the gun is SUSAT ready, without making modifications. Link to post Share on other sites
Angry Posted November 10, 2007 Report Share Posted November 10, 2007 Thanks for the update FarEast, I was wondering how these were coming along. I think that I'll be getting one somewhere down the line, probably after a VFC SCAR. Link to post Share on other sites
FarEast Posted November 10, 2007 Author Report Share Posted November 10, 2007 Im jus hoping that the gun is SUSAT ready, without making modifications. It was one of the changes requested that instead of being a 20mm rail, it would have the rail for the SUSAT and then an optional 20mm rail. Link to post Share on other sites
Domz Posted November 10, 2007 Report Share Posted November 10, 2007 Shame I bought an ARMY and cant afford both, looks pretty good. Echo those earlier questions although the gearbox was meant to be "secret" last time we asked. I wonder how the charging handle is attached... If some people prefer the A1 one I might swap. Yeah SUSAT compatible would be good, even better, release a cheaper SUSAT to go with it! Link to post Share on other sites
mikoyan99 Posted November 10, 2007 Report Share Posted November 10, 2007 Looks great- I may finally get my hands on an l85 (Don't want to bother with internal mods on the others out) that works properly and is a decent replica. Is the foregrip the right size? I havn't had enough experience with the rs to tell without comparison-they still look a little large to me. -matt Link to post Share on other sites
house3000 Posted November 10, 2007 Report Share Posted November 10, 2007 well I'm impressed by their willingness to stick at it but just have overwhelming feeling its too late to market (not neccessarily too little too late but too late all the same) I do wonder wether they'd have been better canceling this once it started to get bogged down in favour of getting ahead of the competition on another gun rather than playing catch up on this one. i dont think this is too late at all. finnaly what should be a reliable and affordable l85 will come to market instead of having to fork out £400 for the star version or spend more time trying to fix the other two than actually using them. i am definately interested in this and will be pleased to see it on the shelves. will Link to post Share on other sites
Abelius Posted November 10, 2007 Report Share Posted November 10, 2007 Agree totally with the previous poster. The current situation between L85's is a tradeoff, good quality for a ridiculous prize (STAR) or problems with a small prize (AA), or in case of G&G, grief with a big prize. There is a market for a working and good quality, decent L85 replica that needs no big work to make it work. Link to post Share on other sites
Lance Jackass Posted November 10, 2007 Report Share Posted November 10, 2007 Looking good. They need to make sure that the bolt is fixed on in a secure way. Its a problem thats plagued all the other sa80s - the bolt can be snapped off if it is knocked against something. This looks nice - a bit late in coming, but still worth having. However if ICS really want to make money and satisfy airsofters i would suggest that they give serious thought to: 1) Making a replica susat (x4 magnification) that works well - decent eye relief. 2) Perhaps look at creating a red dot sight version of the susat 3) And this ones a biggy... create a copy of the LLM01 - laser light module. Its one of the few SA80 accesories, neither STAR, G&G or ARMY have made one and it fits a multitude of other guns. I seriously suggest they consider making one, even if they dont go ahead with the SA80 release. Even if it just retained the light and laser function, that would be enough. Link to post Share on other sites
sniper_boi Posted November 10, 2007 Report Share Posted November 10, 2007 It was one of the changes requested that instead of being a 20mm rail, it would have the rail for the SUSAT and then an optional 20mm rail. Ah now thats good to hear. Cheers for the update on ICS's L85 Link to post Share on other sites
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