12 replies to this topic

[lin_pointer]

http://airsoft-news.eu/news.php

looks like a aeg version of genuine escourt system. amazing!
hopefully this will be cheap, and reliable.

[snorkelman]

aye added it to the existing thread this morning

blowback looks good (length of bolt travel to be expected) but two things concern me

1st its looking more like a type 89 specific and less of a generic one size suits all solution

2ndly whats happened to the AEG nozzle setup of the first one? Are they going back ot the escort style fire from exhaust stroke and using the airshaft as the loading nozzle - hows that going to translate to an AEG hop unit where the nozzle seals the hop unit at point of firing versus the standard escort setup where the shaft is rearwards at time of firing?

[lin_pointer]

it looks very like a genuine escrt base design

[my_plague_666]

interesting. recon escort will stick with the sealed design for their mechbox? or go for a more 'open' design like this?

[snorkelman]

interesting. recon escort will stick with the sealed design for their mechbox? or go for a more 'open' design like this?

well as I understand it tis still escorts baby as far as developement work goes, so what you see here is most likely current state of play with the escort GBB mechbox development in general, not just the variant being developed for TOP.

[my_plague_666]

i think its quite a clever move personally. it'll allow you to hook up bolts and ejection ports without modifying the shell. this is certainly looking incredibly promising. if the price tag remains close to escort's original figure i'll probably switch all of my guns over to an escort system.

rather impressive kick, i'd be interested to see how hard it kicks when hooked up to some of the heavier bolts out there like the AK and M14.

p.s. how possible do you recon a burst system would be?

Edited by my_plague_666, 15 January 2008 - 02:39 PM.

[lin_pointer]

it dose have a burst, watch the video more carfully, and escort's system is not mech sealed, but rather maining that the air that is transfering the bolt is also use to shoot the pellet, unlike gbb pistoles. hince sealed. this has nothing to do of coviering up of the mech of escourt.

Edited by lin_pointer, 16 January 2008 - 12:35 AM.

[snorkelman]

it doesnt have burst from what I can see - If memory serves me right they switched from auto to semi at one stage of the video, but didnt get selector quite out of auto and took pressure off trigger soon as they realised their mistake in order to set selector into semi properly.

If it had X-shot burst Id have expected them to have made a lot more play of that fact in the video rather than just spending most of their time alternating between auto and semi (because there isnt a single escort gun out there to date that has burst fire facility, which would make that a pretty big deal to be showing off).

The new design might make for easier fitting of a bolt (was nowt wrong with the old design when it came to that anyway) but thats missing the potential negatives this new design brings to the party (by new I mean this one versus the initial prototype not their gas mechbox versus a standard escort gun)

1 dimensionally theres a lot more going on the back of the box now

ie the initial drop in designs blowback mech looked a lot more one size fits all (bar the lower which was always fire select etc dependent) For those of us upto it building an escort style fire select mechanism that wasnt a biggie it just needs a bit of thought in designing it not a lot of facilities at manufacture end.

However if this is transmogrifying into a Type 89 secific box then one of the attractions would be gone - ease of adaptability to other guns, rather than having to wait for a manufacturer to produce one specific to the gun you've got (as above provided you can take care of your own fire control group design and manufac).

Even for those who dont have facility/willingness to make their own lower and FCG, if the upper is becoming increasingly gun specific thats more work for escort to do each time they want to adapt the system to a different rifles mechbox requirements (and the more work required the less likely it'll be/longer it'll take for them to roll a variety of units out to suit the major box variants)

2 Its looking a lot more beefed up at the front than previously - with what little space is available trying to maintain AEG mechbox dimensions thats going to eat further into the length of powered bolt travel.

3 most important one - theres no sign of the AEG style nozzle that appeared to be part of the initial design. Standard escort sytems use a combined airshaft and loading nozzle (one part does both functions) The difference is standard escort systems also make use of a dirty great big thick hop rubber and effectively create a sealed chamber between the barrel hop and piston chamber.

This on the other hand is supposed to work with AEG hop units, which have the nozzle forward thru tappet plate spring tension ahead of the piston supplying a squirt of compressed air down the nozzle for firing the BB.

With an AEG style nozzle I can follow the logic as far as performance goes fitting a system like this onto an AEG hop unit ..but without that wheres the efective seal between hop unit and mechbox coming from? ie if its reverted back to conventional escort design then the airshaft-come-nozzle is going to be retracting at point of fire and the AEG hop unit is not going to be sealed by an AEG style nozzle as it normally would. Instead all you really have is seal between mechbox shell and lip of the hop unit

Course it might just be that the nozzle isnt visible in any of the images due to the overhanging brass outer bolt, or just hasnt been fitted for this stage of demo videos, but for the moment untill I see sign of a nozzle thats forward while firing Im sceptical about the effective performance of these using a conventional AEG hop unit. To the point where Id want to be holding one and seeing it work in practice rather than just relying on it in theory.

Edited by snorkelman, 16 January 2008 - 01:50 AM.

[lin_pointer]

if you actually spend enough time on CA.net, u would've realixe that the bottom gearbox uses an aeg tappet plate that gives you fire mode functions, so yes I think it does have bursts........... look at the vid at :35

[lin_pointer]

all I can say is, about time escort! and please make this system adaptable to all aeg bodies!

[snorkelman]

if you actually read what I wrote you'ld see that

the current one i.e.

the latest TOP type 89 one

the one in the video thats linked to at top of this pge

the one that superceeds the info we had to go on from the FIRST prototype

DOESNT have any AEG style nozzle showing anymore

Now seeing as this one is the latest prototype and the other one was the previous prototype which one would you rather go on the photos of?

the issue with prototype 2 - no current sign of any AEG style nozzle raises the prospect that they've maybe gone back to the normal escort 'combined airshaft and loading nozzle' setup. Which raises the issue of how effective that setup will be at getting the air to go where they want it (behind the BB and down the barel) without a shitload of it escaping between front of the gearbox and the lip of the hop unit.

Lost air is wasted air .Wasted air is inneficiency. Ineficiency is reduced shot count. Which makes that issue rather important.


The 'bottom part of the gearbox first prototype and new prototype' gives you fire control?

Course it does. Control of wether its in Safe, semi or full auto. Same as any other escort SMG or assault rifle. 'Fire modes' doesnt automatically equal burst modes


As for your '0.35min part of the vid shows burst mode fire' well sorry but I still dont see it

You have a minute plus video during which someones shooting auto, then firing semi, then switching to auto again repeatedly. Ad infinitum.

In amongst all that we're supposed to believe that a single solitary two round 'burst', fired at one of the stages where he was in middle of his regular pattern of going from auto to semi, isnt simply a missaligned seletor switch, but actually indicative of a two round burst facility? When:

A he never repeats the performance the whole way thru the vid

B the gun stops shooting that 'two round burst' soon as he takes his finger of the trigger - if he was demoing burst fire he'd have let it double cycle and held the trigger back to show it was a deliberate fire mode

C no escort gun has ever had burst fire modes included - if it did it would have a you tube video up sooner than you could say 'gas blowback' With loads of footage of the burst mode - not just one two round 'burst' 35 seconds into the vid never to be seen again for the remainder of the vids duration!

Sorry but I'll stick with past experience of escort guns and say he simply made an arse of switching to semi from auto, didnt rotate the sector cam sufficiently to diesengage the full auto trigger plate, and didnt realise he'd done so untill he pulled the trigger and let loose two rounds rather than the single one he was expecting. Its easily done particularly when you dont have a pistol grip to orient the relative position of things. Much same as he made an arse of where the trigger was later in the vid

Edited by snorkelman, 16 January 2008 - 05:39 AM.

[lin_pointer]

yeha now that u mentioned. I guess u could be right. ofcourse, I think the gearbox is attached to a normal hopup unit. giving it some aeg similarities. the air nozzel seams to puzzle me at first, but maybe they just didnt put it on?

[scooberoo]

Well done to the guys who made this prototype. There's just been way too many "teaser" videos in the past year and still we have nothing to buy.