49 replies to this topic

[Carrion]

http://bp0.blogger.com/_QKktnGoSjVc/R8tJjl...0-h/FebRose.jpg


got back from my hols to find that on my door mat
surfice to say i will be calling the muppets shortly

[Hedganian]

The scan is a bit too small to read, but it looks to me like someone is campaigning to have "BB guns" banned.

Isn't that what the VCRA did? Or was supposed to do? Stop Johnny Chav getting cheap springers and shooting grannies with them - although, given that these cheap springers have an effective range of about 2 feet, with 0.12g BBs, I'm not sure how much harm they could cause.

[chris u'5]

http://bp0.blogger.com/_QKktnGoSjVc/R8tJjl...0-h/FebRose.jpg


got back from my hols to find that on my door mat
surfice to say i will be calling the muppets shortly

Im really getting sick of all this *beep*!
Its about time the shooting community stood together against this rubbish.
You never hear the facts from our side and this kind of scaremongering is slowly chipping away at our sport.
The media and politicians continue to spout complete nonsense without any regard for the truth and nobody seems to want to do anything about it.

[djl]

I don't get it. Are they Mothers Against Guns, or Mothers Against Make-Up?
I mean really, if some NuLab opportunist is sending a photographer around to put your face on the front of their local party-political rag, set aside a few moments to de-skank before they arrive, yes?

Now look what they made me do, I've gone and made it all personal and unnecessary.

Edited by djl, 17 March 2008 - 11:58 AM.

[ED-SKaR]

Mothers against reality(and other anti gun groups) have a point. Mis use of real weapons have caused many a problem, replica weapons CAN be problematic too. now they are hardly as dangerous as real weapons, but the percieved danger is real(if you get my meaning). Banning theese guns from jonny chav is good, restricting replicas to Airsofters (and other RIF owning groups) who are grown up and sensible is a good idea.

However, the moment they decide that they want to go further and restrict law abiding airsofters (and other RIF owning groups) from SAFLEY owning NON LETHAL replica firearms, then they have gone too far.


I do aggree we need a public voice that wont be stomped all over by anti gun groups, but i know nothing of this. Any airsofters work for a newspaper?



PS i am all for throwing the ban on handguns away, so long as its done properly and not just any Tom Ritchard* or Harry can get hold of one.

*word filter, lol

Edited by ED-SKaR, 17 March 2008 - 12:15 PM.

[Carrion]

ed in an email to the hulme labour team i said as much regardning all firarms inc replicas

[balberoth-the-destroyer]

Unfortunately any correspondence you have with them over this issue will result in your words and meaning being either skewed to make you look like a threat, or simply replaced with something that makes you look like a nutter.

This is how politics works, you release a nice statement that gives you a nice big, catchy headline, basically saying "ban this filth now", and the vast majority of the public go "yay" and clap like four-year olds, this ensures that you get votes.

Airsoft is a minority sport, as a community we will never have any viable means to influence the political system not to shaft us unnecessarily (for the majority vote) and all these calls for "we should make a stand" and "we need to represent ourselves in the media" are counter-productive at best, we need to keep bloody quiet about our situation, and hope that by being totally invisible we will cease to attract the attention of media or Government, meaning that they won't feel the need to ban our entire sport just to make a few more people go "yay" and clap.

[balberoth-the-destroyer]

Also, if you insist on getting involved with the press:
FOR F**KS SAKE DON'T ASSOCIATE YOURSELF IN ANY WAY WITH CALLS TO BRING BACK HANDGUNS!!!!!

Please, it'll just get us all labeled as toy gun wielding nutters who shoot each other, and who want to have real guns, can you not see how that would be twisted to our collective detriment?

[cosmic]

Be interesting to see if other areas of manchester are targeted the same, i'll be keeping a look out!

[Carrion]

actualy i targeted the total ignorance of uk laws. regarding RIFs in general and also the ignorance of ther own partys campaign to force it through via hazel blears (salford MP) which is a ho skip and a jump from my flat in hulme.

oh and balberoth that argument was used for years to stop making sure airsoft was organsied enough to defend itself when the time came

[balberoth-the-destroyer]

Yes it was, and wrongly.
The situation is different now, our hobby is regarded as legitimate by the Government, the only changes that will be made to the VCRA regarding airsoft will be to ban it if the specific defense doesn't work out, so attempting to challenge the current law can only be bad for us in the (very unlikely) event that the Labour party is influenced by what effectively constitutes a rant about UK firearms legislation.

My second point still needs addressing though, the worst mistake we can make is to associate ourselves with real firearms, this allows us to be painted as "pro-gun psychopaths" by the media (and they will, given half a chance) which makes it much harder for us to defend our exemption to the Government, as they will be biased by the need to make headlines that say "Govt stamps down on pro-gun psychopaths"

Our situation is tenuous at best, and we can only make it worse by drawing attention to ourselves, speaking publicly about the defense of airsoft should be done by a Press Office, staffed by qualified people, until we have such a thing we should simply be quiet, as any randomly sent letters to MPs or newspapers will do us no good whatsoever, but have to potential to do us a lot of harm by making us a target for knee-jerk reactions from idiot pressmen and frothing councillors.

[rolling-thunder]

Arlene McCarthy jumps on any band waggon she can to get her horrible fizz in the papers.She neither cares about the facts nor is she aware of them.In a conversation with John Pugh{LibDem southport} he asked was there really a need for RIFs.When i explained what we do he continued asking for the need.I finally pointed out that as law abiding citizens who had done nothing wrong we were being penalised & it didn't matter if he understood why we feel the need to make ourselves look as realistic as possible if we didn't hurt anyone or break the law why should we suffer.Of course this was when the VCR was being discussed & he didn't actually care if they could be converted,to him it was all about the looks.If the prats who sold these toys to Chavs had been reigned in long before airsoft BB guns had become the nuisence they have we wouldn't be in this position now.
Even now i still find Yellow BBs in the street meaning that some idiot is shooting in the street.
I find it really {un}amusing that in the Army i had all sorts of guns,rocket launchers,explosives pressed in to my sweaty little palms but now that i'm a responsible married Father of 4 kids i can't be trusted with a toy unless i have a piece of paper in my hand that says i'm a skirmisher.That piece of paper doesn't alter who i am{unless it makes me less wealthy paying to skirmish just to keep it valid}
I say ban Arlene McCathy.

Edited by rolling-thunder, 17 March 2008 - 01:52 PM.

[balberoth-the-destroyer]

Well that's the real problem isn't it, bandwagon jumping, and the inability for people to see that just because a given hobby doesn't appeal to them, it doesn't mean that it is illegitimate.
I have no interest in horseriding, for example, and horses occasionally injure their riders, and could conceivably trample and injure others, so there is a small element of danger, but the overriding point is that just because I cannot understand why others wish to ride horses for fun, I do not call for horses to be banned, citing that miniscule element of danger.

I'm probably just repeating myself now, but we only have two options:
1} Be unrepresented in the media/political forum, and be mostly ignored.
2} Be visible in those same forums and regarded as dangerous nutcases who can be attacked for cheap points.

I think we should strive for option one, as it's safer for the future of our sport.

[Utty]

The message we should be sending our children is that guns are not toys, they are not fun and they are certainly not cool.

Also children must learn that Santa Claus lives on Mars, not the North Pole/Greenland/Papua New Guinea, and that he's not fun and certainly not cool.

HELLO?? Guns are fun AND cool. Fact.
Boys will always love guns forever. Fact.
Santa is dead, I have his head mounted over my mantlepiece. Bonus fun fact.

Edited by Utty, 17 March 2008 - 03:04 PM.

[Edmiles]

I say ban Arlene McCathy.

I say ban the ignorant.

Oh snap that would only leave a couple hundred people in the country

But seriously, I have not heard of Arlene McCathy before, and why should I when I live in Sussex But this is such nonsense. It is the same old trash that anti-gun/bb gun types always send out, it's almost as if they just copy and paste it off one another. How can she expect people to take her seriously when she most clearly hasn't taken her research (if any) seriously.

[bootneckofficer]

Thats not constructive to this discussion.

Anyway, what really is the problem is that the government are not doing enough to stop RIFs and related items from being sold to underage people. There was already legislation in place where it was illegal to sell these items to underage people before the VCRA. The problem was and still is is that the laws are not being enforced fully. If the police asked the kids where they bought the BB guns etc. then they would be to prosecute those responsible for breaking the law. Banning BB guns, RIFs etc is just another kneejerk reaction to win votes and look like they are doing something productive.

[oldman1980]

But please remember we must tred carefully and TOGETHER. All for one and one for all, and all that stuff. Seriously though. If they (anti-gun control groups) are able to ban airsoft in your country it would only be a matter of time before they could reach out and branch through-out the rest of the airsoft community (other countries). Even though it may not affect all of us at first, unless we stand together as one it might just end up that way (affecting us all).

[Edmiles]

Thats not constructive to this discussion.

Excuse me? I do believe I am allowed my opinion so yes, it is.

[Exhumed]

Excuse me? I do believe I am allowed my opinion so yes, it is.

I believe he was referring to the poster just previous to yourself there.

[Hedganian]

There's little point in discussing this here - same as always. We all know that this sort of thing is a load of rubbish, telling each other how outraged we are by it serves no purpose.

There's little point in campaigning against these people, as it's hard to fight such rubbish. The Sword of Truth seems to be pretty blunt these days, and I've heard there's a campaign to have it banned incause someone might cut themselves with it...

Until the government propose a new law or review of the laws, just let them bark at the moon if they want to.