Redwolf Condemns Clones of Clones Options

[beasthunter33]

In a recent article posted on their website, Redwolf airsoft has expressed distaste in its favourite tactical gear cloning company suffering from "imitators," "wannabes,'' and "Posers." When reached for Comment the Airsoft store only had this to say:

"Redwolf Airsoft does not approve of this brand-jacking and would like to assure all our customers that we get all our supplies from Pantac direct - we will not accept any imitation products from other sources."

The original story can be found at there site, Redwolfairsoft.com. the link is included below.

http://redwolfairsoft.com/redwolf/airsoft/...tail?newsID=832

(IMG:style_emoticons/default/rolleyes.gif)

[tome]

I think the point that redwolf is trying to make, is not that pantac and themselves are losing market share to Pantac clones.

Rather that Pantac are a high quality manufacturer (regardless of whether their designs are original or not) and so they do not wish consumers to be fooled into buying a fake pantac and be let down by the quality of the copy.

[L4byr1nth]

Good to see distributors standing up for manufacturers.

Ben.

EDIT: LEGITIMATE manufacturers.

This post has been edited by L4byr1nth: Jun 30 2008, 10:56 AM

[QQexDERA]

Total hypocrisy. Nowt more you can say on the subject!

[tome]

Total hypocrisy. Nowt more you can say on the subject!

I don't know about that........ Pantac build quality is comparable to, if not better than most real deal gear manufacturers. Comparing my old Phantom CIRAS to my cousin real Paraclete Hard Plate carrier, the quality in build and materials is only very slightly better in the Paraclete.

Depends on how you look at it. If you're looking at it in terms of Redwolf telling you not to buy Pantac copies because they'll lose out then yeah that's hypocrisy. In terms of them warning you that there are other manufactuers out there trying to pass off their inferior goods as pantac, in order that you will think that the product is of a higher quality than it really is...... well that isn't really hypocrisy is it?

[QQexDERA]

When you're talking about manufacture, then yes, I agree with you. If we're talking solely about the design, then its just plain old hypocrisy.

[Sale]

I think the point was that some companies have copied the products down to the label, and it could lead to a situation where customers are misled.

Pantac may not have original designs, but at least they don't try to pass their stuff off as genuine Eagle or other brands.

-Sale

[Zhang]

This is not about cloning designs, it's about brand fakery.

Prometheus gears are technically clones of the original TM designs. Wouldn't you be angry if you bought fake Promy parts? Well guess what - that's happened recently to airsofters.

Pantac is the same thing. Most airsofters don't use real gear, but they prefer high quality replicas. When a company produces low quality gear that masquerades as high quality pantac stuff, customers will be angry and disappointed. It's not that it's wrong to produce low-quality gear - there's plenty of poorly-made gear out there - it's just wrong to sell it under another brand name. Pantac may copy gear designs but they sure as hell don't add Eagle labels to the stuff they make.

[Hispeed1]

Eagle Industries was probably saying the same thing about Pantac...

[masakarijoe]

i agree with this. good job redwolf. i may just buy from them now... but probably not
-Joe

This post has been edited by masakarijoe: Jun 30 2008, 03:53 PM

[Jagdraben]

I'm guessing Redwolf isn't unhappy about clones of clones, they're unhappy about counterfeit clones.

As has been previously said, Pantac isn't counterfeit Eagle/Paraclete/&c. It's clone Eagle/Paraclete/&c. Which puts them in the same boat as "Blackhawk!" Counterfeits of any variety are a cause for concern, though. If they're counterfeiting Pantac, now, how long do you think it will be until they counterfeit Eagle or Paraclete?

[beasthunter33]

I guess the humor of the situation was missed by some...that was what I was trying to hint at lol.

I honestly thought the whole thing sounded like a bad ONION article.

This post has been edited by beasthunter33: Jun 30 2008, 04:14 PM

[Hilts]

I've got a Pantac rig and have found it to be very good quality - I'm assuming that WGC as well as Redwolf are getting the 'genuine' (IMG:style_emoticons/default/wink.gif) Pantac gear. Whilst Pantac may be 'cloning' other manufacturers designs, at least they're not trying to pass them off as the genuine article.

Eagle Industries was probably saying the same thing about Pantac...

If the Eagle rigs hadn't been out of stock for over 3 months, I would have one of those rather than a Pantac...

I guess the humor of the situation was missed by some...

Not at all (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)


Cheers (IMG:style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif)
H.

This post has been edited by Hilts: Jun 30 2008, 04:19 PM

[Sale]

Eagle Industries was probably saying the same thing about Pantac...

What they did was pursue their rights for the patented designs and copyrighted names (CIRAS to be exact), but for the designs they haven't patented they can't really do anything. As long as Pantac doesn't affix Eagle labels on the products, the former shouldn't have further complaints.

-Sale

[fal]

Eagle Industries was probably saying the same thing about Pantac...

Keep in mind that large portion of BHI gears are direct copy from Eagle ID and some of their old models are even direct copy of LBT products. If Pantac is to be claimed for copy right infringement, so is BHI.

That being said Pantac/Phantom produces high quality yet affordable replicas. To my exprience Guarder is the best among repro gears. Very tough and almost identical quality to the real deal. Even better than Pantac in every way. Gave a drop leg holster made by Guarder to whom got deployed to Iraq (Army recon sniper.) and it held up just like any other high quality real deal gears. In fact it was longer lasting than his last holster which was made by BHI. He really liked it and didn't care it was replica or not, as long as it was holding up together and serves its purpose. It's usualy civvies being anal about real/authentic gears and more than often preferably made by USA, UK and/or Austrailia. Soldiers seem care little to none about being authentic or not as long as it works.

As far as productcs such as plate carrier goes(CIRAS etc.) Pantac claims that this product is specificaly designed for airsoft and not for real world use. So at least they are being honest of what they are selling.

What redwolf is claming is good on their part. No one wants to buy low quality fake gear branded as Pantac, when it is in fact not produced by Pantac at all.

[Mike_West]

Watch out for counterfeit HFC M190s then. They look like the original on photos, but I'm not willing to grab another Beretta for comparison.

[yubbermax]

I actually like Pantac gear as opposed to Blackhawk, which I despise (IMG:style_emoticons/default/dry.gif)

[Mig1]

IIRC non-mil contract Blackhawk and SDS gear is made in Vietnam.

Which is fine by me, I'm just saying, most of what we buy is made in Asia anyway.

[uscmCorps]

One thing that should be noted however is the materials used in replicas may differ from those of real deal manufacturers. For example, a lot of real deal gear is made with minimizing IR in mind. The Military grade materials used by most real gear manufacturers is what people in the gear and garment industry call 'Firsts'. Military grade materials that have some minor defect (could be asomething as minor as a slight distortion in the camo pattern) is refered to as 'Seconds'. Defects worse than that are refered to as 'Thirds'... And so on. It's very rare that civilians get access to First grade materials, usually Seconds at best (US material reseller DIYTactical only sells Seconds/Thirds). Pantac and most other replica gear manufacturers rarely have access to Milspec (not even Seconds) grade fabric... The material is usually made in China and itself is replica material with no IR minimizing properties. Now while this is fine for the vast majority of airsofters who don't care about that stuff, I get worried for the operators in the field who unsuspectingly get replica gear not realizing it won't work the same in all circumstances.

I just want to point out that theirs more to gear than meets the naked eye... even though that doesn't concern airsofters in most circumstances.

[Kretschmer]

It's usualy civvies being anal about real/authentic gears and more than often preferably made by USA, UK and/or Austrailia. Soldiers seem care little to none about being authentic or not as long as it works.

Hell yeah. This is something not to forget. Also, most airsofters doesn´t need a first class campaigning loadout for a week in the desert. There´s nothing wrong with clone/replica qualities, most people adapt budget to use.

The material is usually made in China and itself is replica material with no IR minimizing properties.

Just pick a night fight and see how chinese multicam is sooo easy to see on night vision. That doesn´t happen even with some old nam original tigerstripe, 80´s three colors or the most simple and cheap spanish trooper camo. But it does with clones.